“The scenes will return, like deranged ghosts, to haunt those of us who were at the graveside to witness the burial of a secular dream. The screams of exultation with each blow of a pickaxe, each thrust of a rod, each dome that came crashing down. If there were no implements, the frenzied hordes would have used their bare hands to the same effect, so powerful was the poison that coursed through their veins in those few hours of madness” (Dilip Awasthi Ayodhya)
It is now clear, from various reports, that in the Gujarat Legislative Assembly elections, 2002, Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) used the Gujarat pogrom effectively to consolidate Hindu sentiments and the majority Hindu vote. The result was an overwhelming victory for the BJP. It is a pity that today, the same contender, Narendra Modi, finds it indispensable to play the anti-Pakistan card for Hindu consolidation. For those concerned with India’s democratic and secular fabric, this persistent politics of hatred certainly marks the end of India’s tryst with destiny.
In a recent speech, Modi vowed to attack Pakistan and bring Dawood Ibrahim to India, if he comes to power. Although, it’s the similar jingoistic election stunt as conquering the Delhi Red Fort stunts by Jamaatud Dawa and Difa-e-Pakistan Council. But such a statement, from the probable prime minister of the world’s biggest democracy, exemplifies what the future under a BJP-dominated government may look like for the region.
Not to deny that the ‘deep state’ on both sides are avowedly against each other. But unlike India, all major political parties in Pakistan that hold considerable electoral leverage, like the Pakistan Peoples Party (PPP), the Pakistan Muslim League-Nawaz (PML-N) and the Muttahida Qaumi Movement (MQM) – except the Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaaf (PTI) – want better relations with India. On the contrary, in India, even the leftist parties that represent secular credentials, like the Indian National Congress (INC), hark back on jingoistic patriotism of the BJP when it comes to normalising relations with Pakistan.
The problem with the BJP is that it has created a highly chauvinistic narrative on Pakistan, based on preaching hatred that goes back to the partition days. In the domain of foreign policy, Modi’s various statements manifest that the party retains a maximalist position whereby the totality of India’s relationship with Pakistan hangs on the issue of cross-border terrorism.
Of late, Pakistan appears to be pushing for a series of dialogue with India on all contentious issues, keeping its traditional position of ‘let’s talk Kashmir first’ on the back-burner and focusing more on bilateral trade, stabilising the line of control (LOC), management of borders and the likes. Unfortunately, India primes itself for a stronger anti-Pakistan stance and fails to reciprocate with the same vigour, even as Islamabad appears to aspire to settle things between the two neighbours.
However, last time the two countries had a major breakthrough was during the BJP government in Delhi and the Nawaz-led civilian government in Pakistan. Whether Modi can turn out to be another Atal Behari Vajpaye is yet to be seen.
It is imperative that Modi and the BJP realise that Indo-Pak cooperation is indispensable for regional stability. It also necessitates that instead of such imperialistic statements, India must play a more positive role in the region.
The views expressed by the writer and the reader comments do not necassarily reflect the views and policies of the Express Tribune.
Please , lets not be too negative about this. He deserves a second chance . A lot of water has flown down the bridge since ….
At least research before you post,BJP was formed in 1980.
Too much inaccuracies in your article ,better luck next time
I personally dont like pakistanis and I hardly care about India pakistan relationship..As an Indian youth ,I want my country to grow enormously in the field of science and technology and more-so economically..
Nawaz talked a lot about wanting good relations with India but after he came to power there has been no movement . Has there been any progress on 26/11 or the so called MFN status . Good relations do not happen because you want them to happen they happen when you address the issues of the other party . The UPA was a weak and confused govt , Modi is more focused and i see hope for better relations between the two countries if both play ball.” In a recent speech, Modi vowed to attack Pakistan and bring Dawood Ibrahim to India, if he comes to power”. The first part of this statement is false the second part there is no change from the position of the GOI since the 1993 . Please do not try to add fuel to the fire.
@Et: This is height of biased reporting and then you guys complain why world don’t take you seriously.
I sincerely feel the kind of thoughts these young Pakistan have is due to their helplessness they find tackling their own country. This attitude of burring heads in sand have led your country to this level.
For India I must tell u all democracy n secularism fans, lndia in history after independence have never tolerated a communial or anti democratic leader. So I would like world should trust those Indians once again in their decision whatever it might be.
These are the same Indians that are achieving milestone in every sphere of development with taking accounts of their demerits in world. Nobody n no religious fanatic can fool 1.25 billion indians, and if at al if indians get wrong in their judgement then they hold that power to overthrow such rulers n get things correct as in the past.
Modi did not say he would attack Pakistan – pls stop spreading these canards. (In fact, I would neither say that the US attacked Pakistan during Operation Neptune Spear, but that is another subject). How sad that a country of 180 M should feel offended because people want to target terrorists and criminals that its intelligence agency treats as their assets. I think a BJP Government in the Centre is a good opportunity to make substantive progress on Indo-Pak trade – and to spend less time in unproductive talks that are mere photo-ops; there needs to be a goal in dialogue – dialogue itself cannot be the goal as has been the case in the last 10 years.
The auhtor is totally biased and is either ignorant or he considers that readers are ignorant. So let him be informed that the ” Deep State ” exists only in Pakistan . There is no such thing in India .
There is an misplaced sense of self-importance in this blog; the writer needs to understand that Pakistan is a non-issue in this election, since everyone agrees on it; so how can you have Hindu consolidation? You may imagine that India’s muslims have great affection for Pakistan and the truth would be too difficult to digest – which is that Pakistan is a thorn in the side of Indian Muslims and not in the side of India.
“all major political parties in Pakistan that hold considerable electoral leverage, like the Pakistan Peoples Party (PPP), the Pakistan Muslim League-Nawaz (PML-N) and the Muttahida Qaumi Movement (MQM) – except the Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaaf (PTI) – want better relations with India.”
It’s not what major political parties in Pakistan want , it’s what the Pakistan Army and it’s cohorts want , plain and simple. The recent dilly dallying and postponement of MFN to India is as per Pakistan ‘Deep state’s wish’ is a case in point.
It is good to see that people like u are thinking so much of us… Our foreing policies.. But u nedd to worry about pak.. I mean who would like to attack a failed state and merge it with india…
The world is interconnected. Enmity between friends and nations do not last forever. As neighbours we share the same language culture and traditions. It’s more imperative that we coexist peacefully.
author guy must be writing this from the broncs,probably cramped for room so many days which might’ve impaired his reasoning …best part is when he tries to present dawood is pakistan’s red fort ….good going …the fact that jamatud dawa allowed to speak in pakistan itself explains the despondent state of pakistan and it’s civilian govt….about time pakistan shown it’s place ….
Nonsense Modi never said he’d attack Pakistan or bring back Dawood. Do your research first.
@Kashif: Firstly, Modi never vowed to attack Pakistan or any other country. Please base what you have written on accurate copy.
Secondly, what gives Pakistanis like you the right to talk about friendship when Pakistan has done nothing to bring the perpetrators of the Mumbai attacks to justice? Without Pakistan applying salve on this festering sore, all this talk about peace is restricted to a few Punjabis. The rest of India wants nothing to do with Pakistan.
In which interview he said i would attack Pakistan and bring terrorist to India.
Check you facts.
What “India-Pakistan” relations? I thought it is made up of Pakistan sending terrorists or funding terror organizations to apply “thousand cuts” idea and India harping on state sponsored terror from Pakistan. Any change is welcome!.
also of agreements to liberalise trade and visa which become unilateral concessions from India once Pakistan reneges on its side of the bargain in the hope that if they appease them enough they will not send the non-state actors.
Such a shame. If Pakistan had sincerity about peace (as demonstrated by actions) both countries would benefit greatly but then who would approve of series 7 BMWs and multiple corner plots for generals in Pakistan?
Only a deranged person compares Dawood Ibrahim to Delhi.
Dawood Ibrahim is a terrorist, a mass murderer who Pakistan has shamelessly given safe home like it did for Osama. If Pakistan had any sense it would hand over Dawood to India, instead of trying to prick us.
How did you compare the two man? Occupying Delhi and bringing back Dawood for punishing? And what makes you think that the latter is impossible? You think it is so hard to send some people to assassinate Dawood?
Besides, where is your conscience man? How can you even defend Pakistan giving shelter to a terrorist? Are you a terrorist sympathizer, man?
You dont know this man properly..I know him properly as he and his family lives near my house in Gujarat..what he say is clearly what he mean..If he is saying he will bring daud then he may actually mean it..it doesn’t matter to him whatever pakistan or pakistanis think on this..he is a man just like sheron or benjamin netanyahu from Israel….and he beleives in israel but not in state like pakistan..pakistan has really got a tough task ahead….I hope if ever in next 10 year he talks to any pakistani prime minister or minister he treats them in good manner as it is known he doesn’t bear people who are weak and beggars………..
I dont think modi will talk about pakistan in the future. he will end all relations with pakistan in coming years.
Has Modi said even one thing that is against the fundamental principles of Indian constitution? Has he said anything that suggests he would deviate from the foreign policy followed by India? Cross border terrorism is and will be the key factor in determining how Indo-Pak relations will be.
U r just one more fan and disciple of zaid hamid. The secular india is still thriving and muslims and sikhs and hindus and Jains and Christians are all celebrating the Idea of India. India first and religion 2nd. Pakistan and Pakistanis are afraid that they have lost one milking cow when Osama was killed by USA and now they are going to loose Dawood. Instead of asking their government why they harbor fugitives and mass murders they are worried about loosing them.
Remember, Mumbai has still not been settled and an abbotabad type mission is around the corner and yes, Pakistan should be attacked if they continue to aid and abet terrorism and terrorists.
You should have included about the genocide of Hindus in pakistan since 1951 and breaking of Liaquat nehru pact 1950. That is what Modi is talking about, He is talking about having relationship of that of Canada and America, so that Pakistani Hindus can come to India anytime and Indian Muslims can move to Pakistan anytime. He believes in two nation theory and advocated openly, question is then why suddenly Pakistani are against two nation theory and not ready to extend help to India Muslims.
So what exactly anti-pakistan stance is about?
it is highly unfair to say that PTI is against the cordial relations between Pakistan and Pakistan. In fact, it’s the other way round; they are one of the big proponent of better relations with the eastern neighbor.
I continue to be disappointed with our (blog) writers who do not seem to do their homework when it comes to history. May be the the news of Kargil war or the terrorist attacks in Mumbai Taj hotel never reached.
Please dear DAAD scholar do your homework and do not insult our intelligence.
Opening quote is out of context. Moving words of Dilip Awasthi apart what has mosque to do with Indo-Pak relations? Some appear to suffer from a self-serving misconception that Pakistan & Muslim are synonyms. Mosque & Mandir dispute (like Guj-2002) is an Indian issue & Indian Muslims & Hindus will deal with it, thank you. Many like me may find BJP unacceptable but that’s natural in a democracy. Reg Modi: Ind-Pak relations are not on such a wonderful high that he can cause any damage. If at all, things will improve. May be he will export electricity to Pak at special rates without linking the deal with any non-commercial considerations. That will be the beginning of business for the sake of business, as it should be.
right you are. Just as you (an Indian Muslim) and i ( an Indian Hindu) have differed on these very pages many times without me accusing you of being anti-National (as in being pro-Pakistan at expense of India) or you accusing me of being communal.
We Indians will solve our problems and non-Hindus derive their protection from the comstitution not a benevolent PM.
Thanks. Your last sentence is remarkable.Re my being an Indian Muslim:Umr sarri tau kati ishq-e-butaan mein Momin//Aakharee waqt mein kya khaq Muslamaan hongey (Momin, in the love of lovely idols your life was spent//Now that it ends what hope/need you have of becoming a Muslim?) (Hakim Momin Khan Momin,1801-52)
Its not surprising that the narrow minded narrative has seeped deep into the minds of DAAD scholars and the talking point has always been that Pakistan talks writes and point fingers at the Gujrat riots while cleverly overlooking the facts which led to those riots, deftly ignoring the plight of Shias, Ahmedis, Hazaras, Christians, Hindus (rapes, forceful conversions, threats, exodus)?!
Hasn’t it become evident that Pakistans delusional ways, the double faced games played by the establishment (armed forces), the blackmail (either loan us billions or we shall risk our nukes falling in the hands of jihadis) the sheer shamelessness which it brings to the fore in the name of religion and faith is now known to the world! Case in point being that whatever your stance on Kashmir, even your OIC brothers don’t seem to care, apart from using your brave as mercenaries for storming the Ka’aba or quelling Shiite uprising in d’waar il lulu in Manama. Ask any of your neighbors barring India what they think of you – heck: even the Red Army will give you an earful albeit in hushed tones of your involvement in Xinjiang province. Oh by the way the last three Ramadans were disallowed by the Chinese and the Uighars were forced to eat and drink during il siya’am! I or rather the world never gets to hear JUD or other monkeys jumping on the Islam wagon declaring to unfurl the Sabz Hilal on the Great Wall? Lets face it- your brethren are nothing but selective when it comes to Hindus or Hindutva or even India generally!
The insidious ways of haranguing the Hindutva narrative in Muridke or Gujranwaala or GHQ, the 10 Hindu banyas = 1 Mujahid, the 1000 year rule myth, the harboring of dangerous humanity erasing fugitives, drugs and fake currency racketeers, illegal weapon running, a false sense of pride of patriotism / nationalism and most importantly not taking care of your children by creating a myopic and jaw dropping theory that Polio drops are a ploy by the western world to render Momins impotent?!? This is all your doing!!
Lastly, Modi is important at this juncture for a strong business environment, no more appeasing of minorities (either stand up or move on moron) and lastly to break your ‘brahm’ that Pakistan can take on India. Remember this clear and well, one dirty look or one more mischief will lead to Pakistan being bombed to stoneage while your boyfriend China sits calmly as Pakistanis who vouch that we are Chanakyas progeny then kindly give us the opportunity to show how well we play the Chanakya neeti!
Honestly, most Indians do not assign a high priority to peace with Pakistan. No one in India takes Nawaz Sheriff or chances of peace with Pakistan seriously. Until Pakistan accepts the fact that India is a far stronger power and will play a dominating role on the subcontinent and the present status of Kashmir, Siachen, Sir Creek etc are fait accompli, there is no chance for peace, BJP or otherwise. Of course, the days musharaas and mombatthiis to every provocation from Paksiatan are over for good. Mrs. Manmohan Singh has written his farewell letters.
Dear Mr. Kashif Ali,
1) To start with there is *NO* India-Pakistan relation(s). There is a tense standoff at the border and for most countries that share border with Pakistan, this is the best outcome.
2) The so called “breakthrough” are simply rumors. Other than the threat of turning the “terror tap” off, Pakistan has really nothing to give.
3) If your idea of playing “positive role” is giving away Kashmir, good luck to your peace efforts.
If pak-ind relations can survive after 26/11 where 10 pakistani came to india and killed indians why can’t after modi being PM..
Is dawood in pak???
Instead your topic should be headlined……
Will Pakistan survive if Modi comes to power?
“In a recent speech, Modi vowed to attack Pakistan and bring Dawood Ibrahim to India, if he comes to power.”
It’s absolute lie and ridiculous… Please go through his statement before alleging him Mr. Author..
A new India and Indian will emerge in a few short years after Shri Modi becomes PM.
This new Indian man, who goaded by his government will modify his “Weltanschauung” completely so that it suits the realities of the times and environment he is living in
He will also be persuaded by the new government to bring about a greater unity of the peoples of India. When 1 billion people become one harmonious people’s front then their strength is not only, magnified but also projected powerfully over large areas. All the false dogmas and doctrines that have been millstones around the necks of the Indian Volk will fall aside and a true, steadfast and bold national perspective will emerge very speedily and powerfully.
Marxism, Anarchism, Pacifism and pseudo-secularism, which was basically abject pandering to the whims and wishes of the minority community in India will bite dust
In their place shall arise a new national perspective and a new national resolve.
Any outside person or state which tries to interfere with this new growth and dynamism will do so at their own mortal peril.
IT IS RATHER JUMPING THE GUN. Let election results come in and see what happens. Modi’s hard stance on Pakistan is election rhetoric. But keeping in mind that it was always Pakistan that initiated hostilities, who can blame Modi?
Thank you for your interest in Modi. As a scholar, I would have expected you to look beyond the stereotypical anti-Modi opinions columns in order to grasp what is going on in India. Here is an example of why Muslims are flocking to Modi … and its not because of fear.
@Kashif: Firstly, Modi never vowed to attack Pakistan or any other country. Please base what you have written on accurate copy.
Secondly, why gives you the right to talk about friendship when Pakistan has done nothing to bring the perpetrators of the Mumbai attacks to justice? Without Pakistan applying salve on this festering sore, all this talk about peace is restricted to a few Punjabis. The rest of India wants nothing to do with Pakistan.
First of all, the author needs to find a statement where modi has claimed to attack on pakistan to bring dawood back. Second, Pakistan is in a tunnel right now. With so much going on, they can’t afford to have anything going on eastern border and hence all this peace talk is just buying time just like TTP is doing with Pakistani government. Also, Indian government and people know that real center of power in Pakistan is army and not the civilian government and unless it changes, there can not be any long lasting peace since Pakistani army has no incentive for peace with India, whole world knows how kargil was carried out by pakistani army.Third, it wss during BJP government’s tenure when Kargil happened so no wonder no one trusts the mere words of pakisani government.
What is India’s priority today ????
1] Faster economic growth.
2] The rooting out of terrorism from South Asia.
Whether Pakistan wants to be a facilitator or hindrance is its decision. Words have no value, actions will speak. Giving shelter to criminals and terrorists from India will carry high costs. Giving covering fire to terrorists infiltrating will also carry high costs. Pakistan must quickly decide who makes security and foreign policy and convey the same — Military or Ministry of Foreign Affairs. If MFA is a dummy and postman only, Modi is unlikely to waste his time interacting with them. Any talks will have to be pointed and clear, based on what is deliverable.
What India Priority is become the most Populated nation on Earth. eliminate minorities such as Sikh and Muslims. Rape all the foreign tourists. Elect a Prime Minister that want to wage a Nuclear War against its neighbors. Want to create a State that is imperial in power, yet has no idea that the neighbors are the strongest on Earth. India has no idea that that the Minority will be the Majority by 2050, hence the Increase population of Muslims and Sikhs. Has no Idea that tourists has decreased because the Hindu guys can’t keep their thing in the pant. idiots
Did you read my brief write up before making your comment or did you just want to express your frustrations without reading it. Sikh, Muslim, population, nuclear war, tourists and rape — none of this was part of my post. What were you trying to convey and what part of my post upset you ???
I disagree with you totally. It is not the Hindu guys alone who cant keep their pants tight. It is the muslim guys, Read the news carefully. And second most important thing is we dont need 4 male adult witnesses to report a rape case. That is the diff between Pak and India and that shows up in the reported rape cases/
The 4 witnesses are a required proof for INFIDELITY and NOT rape. Gets your facts straight.
I read every day, in this news paper about pakistani raping 5 yr old girls, but it is a wonder that the news escapes you.!!. Rapes happens in India also, but the differencei s, in India is, the news reports it, police and people take action and courts punish the culprits. Not like pakistan where no rapists are apprehended or punished. It is very easy to to accuse someone else.!!!. When rapists in Pakistan are put to death for it, you can talk loud.!!!
What a joke. the proportion of Muslims in India as percent of poulation actually INCREASED after partition. Though a whole country was made supposedly for safety of Muslims 85% of them from what was then India felt safe enough to stay back. The TNT did not even take Sikhs into consideration and were killed, driven out, forcily converted from Pakistan. So where did those Sikhs who were driven out of Pakistan go?
India is not like Pakistan where minorities have been dr iven down from a20% at time of partition to 2% now.
Sikhs and Muslims have become Presidents, PMs, CJs, COAS’, CEC(Chief election commissioners), top film stars, singers, industrialists (even a billionaire), cricket captains and so on. There is no equivalent slogan in India that starts with ‘kafir kafir xyz kafir’ and then making xyz a justifiable object of hate
you are right
your meaningless ranting shows the acute lack of understanding you have of your surroundings.eliminate minorities..Imperial power,strongest on the earth Neighbors,minority to become majority by 2050,tourists……get well soon buddy.
You dont happen to know every single Indian so dont claim to have any knowledge of their priorities, stop embarrassing Pakistanis . Also, you calling them idiots puts you on the same level as them, if thats what you want, you got it.
Of course u guys are raping every minority and force converting them, that’s how u r increasing your head count. And I wonder what weird fascination and fanatasy you muslims have about Muslims population is increasing and blah blah.
And who are you to judge or report tourism statistics in India. Typical Pakistani mentality who barks without reading anything real. Tourism is sound in India. Atleast the tourists dont get bombed every day. Does Pakistan even have a tourism industry ?
Yes , Be careful . Namo is not a non-sense leader and he is an uber nationalist . He has legacies of Mr.Patel and won’t entertain pakistan any more . Last Sunday he talked about cancelling of Indus water treaty unless Pak behaves properly . If Modi comes to power , you will see the rise of nationalism in India .
Pls share link of where he talks of cancelling the IWT.
There is across the party dislike of Pakistan in US.
Republicans started the Drone attacks, Democrats increased it!
Same with UK.
Same with many other countries in the EU.
Did you know Kuwait doesn’t even give visas to Pakistanis? Iran warned recently that it’ll pursue Terrorists inside Pakistan. China politely asked Pakistan to remove Terror affecting China. So did Afghanistan!
Maybe its not India, which has a problem.
Do you agree that :
a) Pakistani is the Terror epicentre of the world?
b) Do you agree that Pakistani Civilians are toothless and waste of time to talk to?
c) Do you agree that Pakistan hosts Terrorists which harm neighbouring states?
d) Do you agree that Afghan Refugees and illegal immigrants should go back and in principle do you dislike Illegal Immigration?
If you agree to all this, why blame Modi for saying the same exact thing? Why the double standards when judging Modi?
Please treat Modi up to the standards you would treat your heroes.
I dont, and neither expect many to agree with b, but a, c and d are on point.
Nalla our observation has been that Pakistani civilians repeatedly reqch agreements with Indian civilians on trade, bisa liberalisation etc. then when India implements its commitments and expects Pakistan to do the same, somehow ‘assets’ like the LeT leader are activated and Pakistan fails to implement its commitment. The impression we in India have is that is is the army that activates these assets preventing the civilians from implementing their commiments.
If you disagree with b) then that would imply that the civilians enter he agreements knowing full well they have no intention to implement anything and then use civilian/military stand off as an excuse. Even if that were the case, does it make sense to spend energy reaching agreement with a party that is prima facie dishonest?
I dont know about anyones agreements on trade, visa liberalization etc, but what i can assure you is that through my meetings with people of numerous races, religions and cultures, I have found some of my closest friends in Indians, Hindus and Sikhs to be precise. Dont look at where that person is from, but who that person is. Rather, if I was to leave my opinion of Indians to the comments section of ET or a patriotic Pakistani youtube video (which btw has nothing to do with India), I would have a complete opposite view of those people, and may even view all Indian civilians as “toothless and waste of time to talk to”. I understand where you are coming from, but what I am trying to convey is that just because you encounter a bad experience(s) with someone, do not put the blame on the other million who hold the same nationality.
i surely agree with your humane sentiments. Most Indians will have friends from other religions and that is not considered odd or strange at ll in India. But because i live oustside India, . I also have Pakistani friends whom i value. I think (though i am not sure) the reference to civilians by Anoop was not to indiidual Pakistanis but the civilian government which seems to never honor its commitments. I hope that makes more sense now.
I’m a Pakistani-American and I totally agreed with the above statement. I honestly can’t visit Pakistan, for the fact that I might get bomb anytime just because I’m an American….I visited Pakistan for 10 days, and left to Dubia, after was neglected to have a TV in my hotel room because the threat from Taliban.
b) Do you agree that Pakistani Civilians are toothless and waste of time to talk to?
Generalization at its worst. Hate is very unattractive! I wont say that all Indians are hatemongers, there are many sane ones, but you continue to prove that there are many closeminded trolls!
A Pakistani Civilian Govt takes an astonishing 67 years to complete one full term!
Just think about it. Even Afghanistan Govt completed its full term in the first go. Pakistan, which had inherited a ready-made system from the British, takes 67 years to complete one full term.
Such a country, can we realistically say its civilians are powerful?
Do you remember what happened when Asif Zardari’s Govt tried to bring ISI under the Interior Ministry?
http://www.dawn.com/news/313820/govt-forced-to-withdraw-isi-decision
This happened as recently as 2008. Imagine the Military orders the Civilians to withdraw.
I am sure you are much smarter than this. While I speak the truth, you accuse me of being a troll.
Tell me who is a troll? A man who speaks the untruth inspire of knowing fully well he is lying, or someone who speaks the truth. Do you even after this think I am generalising? Who is the troll between you and me, please tell.
Mind you I could have taken the Kargil example, but was too tired of using it. Another blast from the past will do for now.
I agree that Pakistan needs to make serious effort to stop infiltration of terrorists into India but having said that if you hang on everything on terrorism, I am pretty sure we are not going to go ahead any where. The two countries need to sit and talk about all these contentious issues and let’s be honest, Pakistan’s civilian governments especially the current and the preceding one seem committed to better relations with India but India has failed to adopt a flexible position. Being a regional hegemon, it’s India that has to play now more subservient role.
You have to understand India is a Status Quo country. No status quo entity, which is overwhelmingly powerful as well, will NOT be flexible.
What Pakistanis ask for goes against the Constitution of India!
In a poker game, the guy with the winning set will not simply give away his game. You have to be a little realistic.
India is a Democracy, it cannot do what Pakistan will consider as concessions as it’ll go against the fabric of the state.
Pakistan has to tone down its demands massively and ask for things which have close resemblance to status quo.
At least pakistani govt. is not promoting terrorism but Indian prime minister is promoting terrorism. RSS leaders were present in BJP meetings to nominate candidates for general elections.
Do you agree that CIA and RAW are promoting terrorism in Pakistan?
Do you agree that Muslims are killed in india because they are muslims?
Yes, an ideal way to fight Terror – Blame it on RSS and the Hindus.
By the way, Boko Haram, Al Shahbab, Al Qaida, HuJI, all over the world the violent Islamist movements are all sponsored and supported by RSS.
In a country where Political outfits such as Shiv Sena and RSS are considered Terrorists, but LeT is a charity organisation, logic often has to take a back seat.
err, have you heard of LeT and JuD and JeM, all “strategic” assets of Pakistan ? Please give me once incident where you ever caught a RSS cadre for any terrorism in Pakistan. Please also add to that list single RAW agent you have caught for terrorism in Pakistan.
Laughable comment.. Care to put it to vote internationally ?
The onus for maintaining good relations should be on Pakistan and especially the Pak army. India has tried hard for peace but every time it got backslashed. Pakistan based terrorists have killed innocent women and children on last terrorist attacks in Mumbai and they will not stop. Considering all this, India should hit back hard. Talks are useless.
You sound pretty closed minded if you ask me. Pakistan is not the epicenter of terror in the world but one of the country fighting it. Militants from tribal regions just reside in the mainly the north western region of pakistan. Also criticizing Pakistani civilians like that just proves your ignorant, discriminative and bias points of views. I reside in UK and many british citizens of british lineage that live here agree with me.And a significant amount of the western world agree’s with me. However i can say that there are many corrupt officials in the pakistani government but the same goes for india. I have lived abroad my entire life and for a little while in pakistan and this generalization that you have concocted is pretty ridiculous.
Hillary Clinton has come on Pakistani soil and accused Pakistan of being a Terror epicenter.
Blair when PM has said so himself.
Most people don’t want to cross the limits of political correctness. In conversations between 2 non Muslims there is no need for it and the truth comes out.
But I don’t believe in political correctness. Don’t care for it when ppl are dying.
Don’t lie like a school child.
Modi never vowed to attack pakistan. All these low class journalists like you are responsible for bad relations between India and pakistan by putting fuel to the fire in minds of people of both the countries.
Hahahaha
Modi is getting vote on the base of muslim and pakistan opposition
But he vowed to attack Indian muslims
Ever thought about secular parties winning in pakistan? or is it taken for granted that there should not be one ever? are there any such parties in the first place?
why whining about India?
You see what you want to see.
I have watched his 3 interviews in this month of May, Regarding Pakistan there were similar thoughts:
I would like to follow Atal Bihari Vajpayee & but any act of terror like 26/11 or small will not be tolerated & i assure the nation that security of any single person of India will be responsibility of Federal Government.
That’s the best comment, yet.
Blogger infested by paki mentality can only magnify rare negatives out of countless positives Mr. Modi has stated..
Pakistan needs to fix itself before thinking about improving relations with ANY other country, especially India. Nobody is coming to help us, not the Americans, not the Arabs and certainly not the Indians. So who’s left? Ourselves. Why not work on the relations between our own states and people, rather than between other countries? Most problems in Pakistan have arised from within and problems can only be solved when their root cause is cured, whether it be religious fundamentalism, racism, corruption or everything else wrong with this country.
Well said.
Please check the facts and data. You are writing on a sensitive topic. ” In a recent speech, Modi vowed to attack Pakistan and bring Dawood Ibrahim to India, if he comes to power. ” The word “attack” is very big thing. Just dont use it to make your point.
What relations ??
Good question, to which i would add one more – what speech? Modi never made any claim about attacking Pakistan for Dawood.
even though india pakistan should have good relations and no war, only peace and harmony- still it is best to avoid too much contact with each other- we should ignore each other benignly- and even ban visas between the two countries- except in emergency cases in the case of divided families- no point in being hypocritical and pretend to be friends when it is not possible to be friends- best is to forgive and forget each other and just remain at peace without any war….
I like the Modi’s picture. Is he showing Pakistan what India would like to do.
I think India can keep the border hot so that Pakistan collapses like USSR. Even now, its Saudi and US aid that keeps it afloat
“However, last time the two countries had a major breakthrough was during the BJP government in Delhi and the Nawaz-led civilian government in Pakistan.”
However, last time when the two had a major breakthrough, India was stabbed in the back at Kargil!
However, before the issue of Kargil was laid to rest, there were attacks on Mumbai!
your words will always be blind to those countries who place religion above the country.
Are you trying to say that Islam preaches hate towards Indians? Lol, quite untrue actually. It is true however, that religion FUNDAMENTALISM has brought forward and expanded the differences between the two nations.
islam fundamentalism is greater than any other religion in the whole world right now.
There is simply no basis for Hindu Fundamentalism. That is why you don’t see it in Pakistan, where Hindus have been mistreated more than any community.
That is why a Sikh can occupy the PMship for an entire decade!
You are falsely equating Islamic Fundamentalism in Pakistan and Nationalism in India.
I do not think the comment reflected on Islam. But rather on those brainwashed Muslims who have been taught that it is justified to kill kafirs and anyone that they decide to accuse of blasphemy. Unfortunately the proportion of sich people is increasing even as voices for sanity like Salman Tasir and now this lawyer Rashid (who tried to defend blasphemy accused in court of law) are cruelly silenced. All this is happening in the name of religion.
Whether relations improve or not remains to be seen but one thing is sure that pakis will not dare to step into India again
Author seems to have no knowledge about modi and India . It seems i am reading child’s written blog who is brainwashed by their people. Total wastage reading it.
Author of this article is from LUMS! I thought LUMS is one of the prestigious institutions in Pakistan or is this all just a hype?
Anyway, let us first be clear on one thing. Modi has not been implicated in Gujarat riots (it is not a pogrom you idiot. look up the definition of a pogrom). This after Supreme Court of India directed a SIT (Special Investigation Team) to investigate. That apart, the ruling congress has tried its best to implicate Modi.
Well, nothing happened. Not a shred of evidence. Does that mean the riots were not orchestrated. perhaps but not by Modi but by the lower rung of party as a spontaneous reaction to the burning of pilgims in the train (about which nobody talks).
Modi has said in many interviews that his realtion with Paksitan would be “we will look into their eyes; we will neither lower our eyes not lift it up in arrogance”. that message is clear. We won’t tolerate nonsense but we will not be the first to create a problem.
So,if Modi is a PM, expect him to be tough on terrorism emanating from Pakistan. He is a decisive man. So, whether India-Pak relationship will improve or deteriorate will depend on how Paksitani establishment (read ISI, Army) behaves vis-a-vis India.
I reject the assumptions in author’s essay but your stance is equally unacceptable. SC set up SIT full SIX years after the Riot & did it expect the trail to remain warm? Obviously the evidence against Modi didn’t exist any more! You have asked author to look up the meaning of “Pogrom”. He will probably follow your suggestion. Meanwhile do read up: ” Pogrom in Gujarat: Hindu Nationalism and Anti-Muslim Violence in India” by Parvis Ghassem-Fachandi, Princeton University Press, 2012. You can have a Kindle edition for less than Rs.1000/- from Amazon. Read the gory details. Also, a lady doctor turned BJP politician Maya Kodnani a Cabinet Minister of Modi was not exactly a “lower rung” riff-raff, was she? If she was “high rung” what is she doing in jail sentenced for 28 years for killing Muslims while her CM-Bossman, who claims to own a 56 inch chest, was not man enough to step forward & take responsibility?
India-Pakistan relationship is under siege by people like Hafeez Saeed of Pakistan. So don’t worry about Modi’s effect on relationship.
@Author: Did you even read the article about “mend your ways” comment by BJP ? Or you just read the title of the article, got patriotic, and decided to vent your prejudices here ?
Secondly, of all the alleged “positive” gesture Nawaz has shown to increase bileteral ties, Pakistan is yet to give India MFN status. It is yet to sign the trade deal. It is yet to act on Mumbai incident. Its like the sinner saying the pious “I forgive you lets start from scratch”. You are in germany as I see. How about visiting it;s one of many public libraries and reading about true history of Indian subcontinent and use your education for better judgement on the validity of Jinnah’s adventure you guys call “dream” of Pakistan.
@ET: This is rebuttal to all this wannabe blogger has written. Such fear mongering is the first step to spoil relationship between sensitive neighbors.
I have said in another forum that Modi may win (the result is not out yet!) on the plank of economic revival. If he goes back on that and starts things like Ram Mandir, uniform civil code etc, he will lose out badly in the end. He would have made young middle class Indians (his very big constituency today) very unhappy. He will land himself in legal hassles and waste valuable time.
I think he knows it. He is a practical man who is good at one thing: organizing. We need somebody at the top who can direct economic acitivity in the right direction making use of the best human resources.
what is wrong with uniform civil code? It is mentioned in the directive principles of our constitution that we should move towards that and moreover Supreme court had also given direction o the government to make an effort to move towards uniform civil code.
Why shold the sword of triple talaq hang over a Muslim woman? Why should she not get the same constitutional protections in terms of inheritance, divorce etc. as a Hindu woman?
Please note – uniform civil code is not the same as Hindu civil code.
I think another big mess Modi can land in would be trying to deport Bangladeshi refugees. These refugees are so well entrenched in India that it is not easy to figure out who is where. They can effortlessly merge with the local population. This would be anothyer non-starter for Modi if he pursues it. However, some mechanism should be put in place to avoid future illegal immigration from Bangladesh.
America national students are studying in my university and they dont have any difficulty
There are Jews also in Pakistan. Somebody being somewhere is not proof of tolerance and lack of threat.
Ahmadis too are living in Pakistan. Are you saying they do not face threats and violence everyday? They can’t even call themselves Muslims and live to tell the tale.
Nepali students are also studying in my university and they are my friends . They can support any team which they want.
Once Nepali student watched video of jihadi leader about jihad in Kashmir. He said “he is also saying the same thing against india which indian modi is saying against Pakistan”.
The relation may be worsed.
Kuch Bhi !!
Modi’s statement on Dawwod Ibrahim, who the entire world knows, lives and breathes in Karachi, was in reference to the Indian Home Minister Shinde. Pakistan, when will you stop attributing unnecessary and unwaranted attention to yourself when you barely deserve so ? If there was something relevant to Pak that Modi said, it was that amidst guns and bombs, talks CANNOT take place. THAT to me is quite a pointer to Indo-Pak talks. RIP AMAN KI ASHA Hawks !
It seems that Modi irritates Pakistan more than anything else. To its utter dismay, on 16th May, the world will know that the people of India have chosen a strong Government that will rewrite India’s destiny in the decade to come.
Due to my past conversations with Mr Anoop, I am pretty sure by civilians he meant the Pakistani public. There is no need to defend him, as there are people like him on both sides of the border. Have a great day.
When did I ever say anything regarding Hindu fundamentalism OR nationalism in India?
In state “ASAM”, in mzafarnagr , these are recent incidents happened in these areas where many muslims were killed.
In Gujrat state in 2002 hundreds of muslims were killed.
And modi govt. was involved in these riots.
your govt. killed thousnads of sikhs and destructed golden temple. these are worst example of terrorism in india by govt. aginst minorities.
Modi government rules in Gujarat not UP. Riots are not the same as terrorism. In riots people from both sides died. Riots should not happen but it is an unfortunate reality for to partition.. But terrorism from Pakistan is most dangerous.and has no justification.
The same type of crimes you accuse Modi of committing, Jinnah has done it too. Direct Action day call by him ended in the death of thousands. I’ve presented the Direct Action manifesto which calls for “Jehad” many times before in this section.
I am sure you think Jinnah is a great guy, but why do you hate Modi? Aren’t dead Bengali Hindus Humans, just like those Gujarati Muslims?
If Shiv sena and RSS are political outfits then plz define terrorists?
May be in india all terrorists are politician.Due to which you dont know difference between political parties and terrorist groups.
Shiv Sena and RSS have never crossed into Pakistan and brutally murdered people of Karachi, like the so-called “charity organisations” like LeT have in Mumbai.
Shiv Sena practices a muscular kind of politics similar to MQM. In fact, RSS and Shiv Sena are much less violent than MQM.
Shiv Sena and RSS vow allegiance to the Indian Constitution, while groups like LeT, TTP believe in overwhelming the state to establish a Caliphate!
I hope you get the point now.
Let is fighting in Kashmir against cruel indian army where people are not allowed to support their favourite cricket team, where people are being killed by indian army everyday.Where peolple are killed for not saying “india zindabad” and for saying “PAKISTAN ZINDABAD”
Not only in Pakistan but they are killing muslims in india.
They are destructing masjids. The destruction of “BABRI MASJID” is the worst example destructed by RSS and Shiv sena with the cooperation of govt.
Do you know anything about the Babri Masjid case? Have you read the Supreme Court judgement?
And pray tell me how many muslims did RSS and Shiv Sena kill in Pakistan?
Pak army has killed more Muslims in Bengal. Do you consider Terrorists too?
I’m sure no. Why double standards?
If you are not muslim then how you can say that they are muslims?
Same was done by Nehru in 1930s and in responce to him Allama iqbal wrote a book titled “Islam and Ahmadism” and a special letter to him.
If you are not muslim then how you can say that they are muslims?
Same was done by Nehru in 1930s and in responce to him Allama iqbal wrote a book titled “Islam and Ahmadism” and a special letter to him.
I am not in the business to refuse people to call themselves whatever they want.
Neither should you.
Ahmadis are Muslims if they say they are Muslims.
If you go down that argument, Shias can also be considered as non-Muslims. That is why they are targeted so often, isn’t it in Pakistan.
He vowed to kick Illegal Bangladeshis out of Assam and surrounding areas. How is that wrong?
Why do you obfuscate?
He talked about Bangladeshis at the the end of election but during whole elections his election compaign was revolving around muslim enmity
I quote from the below link :
http://www.dawn.com/news/1016271
“Under the Hudood Ordinance, the Courts require four “adult male” eyewitnesses to rape. When a female victim fails to produce four male eyewitnesses, she is then charged under Tazeer for fornication. If the woman becomes pregnant as a result of rape, the rapist/s gets a walk, while the woman is charged with fornication using pregnancy as a proof.”
Also, in all the Islamic countries, Rape victims are to bring forth 4 witnesses, especially in Arab states.
http://freethinker.co.uk/2013/05/13/sharia-law-used-in-the-united-arab-emirates-to-jail-australian-woman-after-she-was-gang-raped/
Please do not say now its a misinterpretation and start saying “This is not what Islam says”.
Heard it ad nauseam.
We’ll if it is misterpretated, I shall say it is, regardless of whether you are sick of this ‘excuse’ or not. These so called laws are ridiculous and completely opposite to what Islam preaches. Now I’m not gonna quote the Quran to you, since your opinions on it are ‘ad nauseam’ to me. But the 4 witnesses law is well known to be for adultery and definitely not for rape. You say various things about the absurdity of some Pakistanis, then can’t you imagine the stupidity of the person who implimented this law without any basis?
One more point. I hope my reply to you earlier passes the censors.
To defend a Religion, just an idea with no basis, you are taking me on, a true liberal, who fights for women’s rights, who fights for Science, rational thought.
Like I’ve said before, you are defending a piece of fiction, instead of embracing Rationality. You do not believe in “just-a-theory-evolution” a scientifically proven theory, but have blind faith(which you do not admit is blind at all!) in another theory, which is nothing but a theory or work of pure fiction.
What a pity..
i am 100% sure if punishment is given to rapests according to islam there will be no rape case
A Rape has to be proven by 4 male(why not 4 women) witnesses.
So literally no Rape happens with 4 men sitting around watching. If they are, then they become party to the Rape.
So no woman can prove Rape, hence 100% of the rape cases will turn into adultery cases. So, the statistic will say “No Rapes in Islamic countries!”.
If you want to read about crimes against women from actual people on the ground in Pakistan, then read this.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/afghanistan-pakistan/outlawed-in-pakistan/the-stigma-of-reporting-a-rape-in-pakistan/
We are not talking a few people “misinterpreting” this.
We are talking about entire nations, dozens of them, “misinterpreting” it the exact same way.
Lets say, no nation which calls itself Islamic has interpreted correctly the Islamic scriptures.
Either the scriptures are too open for violent misinterpretation, or it is clear the present interoperation is the correct one.
Pick one.
Neither. Listen Anoop, you knowledge of Islam is next to nothing. All you know is either what you hear on the news, read on ET or the prejudice that many of your countrymen harbour against Islam. You have most likely NEVER read a single chapter of the Quran. How can you understand ANYTHING about Muslims if you dont know what they believe? I personally refrain from talking about topics I know nothing about; you on the other hand, jump right in and act like you have done a phD on Islam. How about you read one para of the Quran and then come back with questions, which I am sure you will have many of? Btw just reading one para will give you your answer(s). And if you choose not to read, then clearly you are afraid of being proven wrong.
Pick one.
This is again a standard excuse of Islamists. “Read the Quran and find out for yourself!”.
Ayaan Hirsi Ali has read the Quran, so has Salman Rushdie, so have many enlightened people, true liberals across the world. I read them.
But, I don’t have to be a Quran expert to question why Boko Haram or TTP or Al Qaeda or most of the Gulf states have near identical views on minorities and women?
So, every non-Muslim you encounter who will ask you why your Religion is churning out such men who believe in such consistently identical regressive ideas, will you ask them to read the Quran end-to-end, then read some supporting scriptures, about the life of some important person.. where does it end? Do I have to get a PhD to ask some simple questions, based on empirical evidence, simple maths?
Is this a ruse to shut me up? You obviously know no liberal non-Muslim like me will do it. Your standard defenses are well known.
Just today there is an article in Dawn which says exactly what I am saying. But, in a mild manner, very politically correct. I tend to skip the political niceties.
http://www.dawn.com/news/1106263/there-is-a-mini-boko-haram-thriving-in-every-muslim-society
You are an Ahmadi, the target of such regressive ideas, and you are obsessed about defending the very faith which is churning out such people who believe in those ideas.
Talk about irony!
I am clearly wasting my time. Your ignorance to learn shines through. What are you so scared of? Maybe the fact that half the things you have ever written on ET will be proven incorrect. Frankly, I have never read a single positive comment from yourself. But then again, its a Pakistani website and you,”a true liberal, a fighter for women’s rights and science”, wont have anything nice to say, right? because thats the hint I am getting from you.
“Do they not travel through the land, so that their hearts (and minds) may thus learn wisdom and their ears may thus learn to hear? Truly it is not their eyes that are blind, but their hearts which are in their breasts.” (22:46)
Have a nice day.
Can you please quote where he explicitly called blood of Muslims? Or, called for harming Muslims?
I mean as a Pakistan how does it bother you. Pakistan actually killed 3 Million Bengalis in 1971 in 9 short months.
But, I am sure it never crossed your mind to protest or ask for action. But, if Modi threatens the illegal immigrants, like he should or any leader who cares for Assam should, you have a problem.
Why this double standard?
In saudi arabia there is no rape case. Why?
Because all the islamic laws are implemented there. Punishments according to islamic laws are given there.
If you want to stop rape by your own ways. why you have not stopped it ? Why india is hell for women ?
Why hundreds of rape happens in india every where?
Don’t you read comments?
As per Saudi law Rape can only be considered Rape if there are 4 male witnesses.
No wonder there are no Rapes in Saudia. Same in Pakistan.
There are more crimes against women in Islamic countries than others. Women can’t even drive or marry as per their wishes.
50% of the people have zero rights. Do u think others are looking and think and can’t make out the injustices in the Muslim world?
You are comparing Modi with Quaid. Excellent
Killing muslims and other minorities is the tradition of Indian leaders not of Quaid.
In bangladesh civillians were killed because of the war broke out by you people. As indira gandhi comment shows We have taken revenge from muslims by creating bangladesh. Because muslims ruled sub continent for thousnad year.
Are you saying Jinnah didn’t call Direct Action day? Or are you saying thousands of people didn’t die in Muslim majority Bengal?
Modi has never called for outright murder. I asked you to quote me where he has said so. No riots in 12 years.
Isn’t Modi much better than Jinnah?
Congratulations to you on becoming Modi as prime minister
most nepali even don’t know what is real thing. hes commenting on some new which is based on lie and those people who wanted to worsen india nepal relation.
please we hope all 3 nations india nepal pak live in peace coz pakistan once belonged to we hindu n we lov it
what do you think now?